The Hen Report: “Just Be That Vegan” | Holiday Reflections and Animal Rights Updates

Jasmin Singer: And a quick reminder about Our Hen House. The Our Hen House podcasts are now divided into multiple episodes. We used to have one long episode. Rising Anxieties comes out on Tuesdays, The Hen Report on Thursdays, and the long form interview on Fridays. Bonus for flock members, which has been fantastic lately, I must say, comes out on Mondays.

So again, we're a podcast and on YouTube, so please hit subscribe and like wherever you listen. It's funny that some people really prefer to watch a podcast, isn't it?

Mariann Sullivan: I do.

Jasmin Singer: Yeah. So does Moore.

Mariann Sullivan: Well, I mean, you know, I, a lot of podcasts are what I listen to when I'm walking the dog, or sometimes when I'm driving, so those would not be good to watch. Um,

Jasmin Singer: True.

Mariann Sullivan: I much prefer to watch, uh, I, I don't know, like I, I pick up more, or I get more depth of what people are saying when I'm looking at them.

I don't know that, that, it is odd, but it's very easy to just kind of zone out when you're listening. All right, everybody don't zone out. Now I'm imagining everybody out there zoning out.

Jasmin Singer: No, it's, it, it is funny, isn't it? Uh,

Mariann Sullivan: I watch podcasts all the time. In fact, I no longer watch any normal television.

Jasmin Singer: Well on the.

Mariann Sullivan: just watched YouTube and I just watched like the news and, you know, and bullshit about the news and people talking about the news. I'm so sick of myself, but I don't know, like things are so dire and, and, and big that when I watch fictional stuff, it just seems stupid.

And you recommended that I watch the Hallmark channel. I tried that and there are very few things that are, that are too stupid for me, but whatever I watched on the Hallmark channel was too stupid for me.

Jasmin Singer: I am shocked.

Mariann Sullivan: I can watch almost anything.

Jasmin Singer: Am shocked because I am kind of the opposite. A lot is too stupid for me to watch, but I love the Hallmark Channel movies.

Mariann Sullivan: Well, I'm everything on the Hallmark channel.

My guess is that it is everything. But I'm not saying that because there might be good things, but like the acting is bad. The acting is bad, and then the people aren't even that good looking. So you wonder like, how did they get the job? Like it's usually one or the other.

And the scripts make no sense whatsoever. They like, if they wanna plot twist, they just write anything. It, it doesn't have to make sense.

Jasmin Singer: Some of them are former child actors, so there's that. Uh, I.

Mariann Sullivan: What? You're a former child actor and, and you just have a job forever?

Jasmin Singer: I don't know, but I will tell you, listen, when Moore and I went to my, uh, niece Lila's Bat Mitzvah, uh, like two and a half years ago in Kansas City, we were staying at a hotel and it was the summer, we were staying at a hotel and there were Christmas trees everywhere and we're like, what's going on? And it was a Hallmark Fest, Hallmark Channel Fest.

Mariann Sullivan: 'cause the, the thing I watched was Christmasy and it was clearly midsummer and all the trees were green. And, and you can, you could even tell just by the light, you know, light is different in the summer than in the winter. And you can tell as soon as you look at it that they're filming this in the summer. It's so distracting. And then there's like a few, like some fake snow around, like on the rose bushes.

Jasmin Singer: This fest was like, you know, mega fans and we get in the elevator and people were like, are you so excited to meet...? and they just like said some guy who's in every movie. Uh, I agree. No, I think it is a little shocking of me. We watched a Hanukkah movie on it the other day. There's four, there's four Hanukkah movies on the.

Mariann Sullivan: Happy Hanukkah, everybody.

Jasmin Singer: And, uh, and we, and nothing happened. There was no plot. Like literally, I'm not even kidding. There was no plot.

Mariann Sullivan: When they have a plot, it doesn't make any sense

Jasmin Singer: And I watched the whole thing. By the way, there's gonna be a new

Mariann Sullivan: speaking of, uh, were you speaking of soap operas? Did you hear that

Jasmin Singer: Luke and Luke.

Mariann Sullivan: died?

Jasmin Singer: I saw him once when I lived in LA at, uh, Hugo's, which is a diner that has a lot of vegan options.

Mariann Sullivan: what we're talking about.

Jasmin Singer: No, I, we have, our audience skews older. They do. They know.

Mariann Sullivan: Yeah.

Jasmin Singer: They know

Mariann Sullivan: still they, they, they have more taste.

Jasmin Singer: Well. Yeah. They're listening to Our Hen House. Although now they're like, why am I talking about Luke and Laura and the Hallmark channel? Uh, but yeah, I did hear that, that

Mariann Sullivan: I mean, which is sad. I'm

Jasmin Singer: operation,

Mariann Sullivan: like, like, I don't mean to, I don't mean to be making light of anybody's

Jasmin Singer: uh.

Mariann Sullivan: terribly untimely, uh, as far as I could tell. I mean, he was in his seventies. Of course I'm in my seventies and I would like to think of it as untimely, so Forget I said all of

Jasmin Singer: Wow, things just got

Mariann Sullivan: Things got dark, fast.

Jasmin Singer: Well, uh, yeah, no, it's, um, you know what's so funny about Hanukkah? It's always been my favorite holiday. Well, I grew, I just wanna say I grew up Jewish. I, I'm an atheist Jew now, but I grew up celebrating Christmas and Hanukkah. We had a Hanukkah room and a Christmas room because my stepfather and my biological father celebrated Christmas.

So we had like elaborate holiday seasons with so many gifts. I mean, you know, like lots of little things. And like, it wasn't.

Mariann Sullivan: Your mother has a gift

Jasmin Singer: A G. Yeah. And I have it too. I, I get a lot of gifts. Yeah. And I, and I really enjoy it. And I'm, I'm, I, I try and get them all, either secondhand or I make them, it doesn't always shake out that way, but it frequently does.

And I, I, I start like six months early and I love it. And I love it. I really do.

Mariann Sullivan: me lovely gifts

Jasmin Singer: Thank you. Good. I'm so glad. Yeah. I, uh, so far you've gotten two, uh, thrifted items in one handmade item, and I just, it's so much fun to me, especially when I have challenging people in my life like you and Moore to get for, because I'm like, okay, I'm up for the challenge and gives me something to focus on.

Um, but so Moore is, yesterday she said we were, we were opening Hanukkah gifts and she's like, I like how drawn out Hanukkah is. And I feel like that's part of like why I like it. It's just like this ongoing thing and, and there's like rituals and it's not that big of a deal.

Mariann Sullivan: When I was a kid, I don't feel this that much anymore. I mean, not just because it's not as exciting, but like the day after Christmas was such a huge letdown.

Jasmin Singer: Yeah,

Mariann Sullivan: I mean now I feel like the whole week is kind of a celebration and you like people plan things for the whole week.

But

Jasmin Singer: yeah.

Mariann Sullivan: when I was a kid, it was like the day after Christmas, like it just felt desolate.

Jasmin Singer: Mm-hmm. I feel that though, that way.

Mariann Sullivan: that, that it, it, you know, it kind of drags on until you're kind of sick of it.

Jasmin Singer: Yeah. Totes.

Mariann Sullivan: To Bill Crystal the other day, who, you know, has always been this extremely conservative commentator who I now love. I don't

Jasmin Singer: I thought you were talking about Billy Crystal. I was like, what are you talking about?

Mariann Sullivan: Actually though, he was talking about the fact, he was talking about, um, Rob Reiner.

And he had met Rob Reiner and the way he met him was that, that he did an ad for the 2020 election that Rob Reiner, you know, donated his, he, he did it it, it featured Billy Crystal and Bill Crystal both, uh, on the same side.

Jasmin Singer: That's funny.

Mariann Sullivan: It was very funny and he, Bill Crystal admitted that he can't act at all and it was really true. Um. anyway, what, where was I going with this? Oh, he was saying he is Jewish and he was talking about Hanukkah and he was just talking about how Hanukkah is such a special holiday for Jews because a lot of the holidays are pretty depressing. Like, like they're not

Jasmin Singer: That's what I was just about to say. I was just about to say that. Well, Rosh Hashanah is celebratory, but it's kind of paired with Yom Kippur. I mean, but I will say that also Hanukkah is not a big deal. It's like it kind of got bigger because of Christmas.

Mariann Sullivan: seriously

Jasmin Singer: Right. And so there's something just it, you end the year with it.

It's lovely. I have frigging Hanukkah socks for like every night of Hanukkah for the YouTube viewers. Here's today's Hanukkah socks

Mariann Sullivan: at y at your socks.

Jasmin Singer: and my socks. Uh, and it's, and then having Christmas too, you know, and it, I, I love gifts. What can I say? I'm a maximalist. I have, I, I, uh, I've been enjoying this.

Mariann Sullivan: Nobody's criticizing you, Jasmin. You're getting overly defensive. It's

Jasmin Singer: People have, people have over the years told me it's too much and stop. And this and that. I'm like, well, okay, you're, you're off my,

Mariann Sullivan: You got a title for your memoir. Always Too Much and Never Enough.

Jasmin Singer: I never, I never actually, you know, an editor titled that and like, now it's 10 years later and the, it's, the title's just gonna follow me around forever. Uh, did you know that Cynthia Erivo has a memoir out now and it's called, uh, something like. Um, Never Too Much or something. I'm getting it wrong, but it said for anyone, hold on, let me, let me see what it's actually called, but it said,

Mariann Sullivan: do have Google here.

Jasmin Singer: yeah, I'm gonna see

Mariann Sullivan: fill in this information. Okay.

Jasmin Singer: Cynthia Erivo memoir, but it, uh, yeah, it's called Simply More a Book For Anyone Who... wait For Anyone Who's Been Told They're Too Much was like, alright, Cynthia, I know I should, I think she's fierce.

I mean, how, who doesn't think she's fierce?

Mariann Sullivan: Nobody tells me I'm too much. They say I'm just the right amount. No, they don't. They don't say anything about

Jasmin Singer: No, they do. They do. I was, uh, I was on a you.

Mariann Sullivan: said I was too much.

Jasmin Singer: No, you're not. No, no, no. Of course. You're not too much.

Mariann Sullivan: I'm not bragging about that. I'm just saying like, I, I don't think I'm all that much,

Jasmin Singer: I don't think ha, I don't think being too, honestly, I think that like, as I've gotten older, I realize that a lot of the times in the past people have told me I'm too much is just because like, I'm a strong woman who takes up space. Admittedly, there are times I have been too much. I recognize that. I had a,

Mariann Sullivan: have your moments

Jasmin Singer: there, I had a, you know, a childhood that required a lot of sorting through in my adulthood, as many of us have.

Mariann Sullivan: We, as we so do actually, that brings up this whole line of thought that I've been thinking of, and it brings up a really, I mean, I, I mentioned Rob Reiner, but it brings up the whole Rob Breiner situation. And I don't know why I'm talking, gonna talk about it, but I am, and it was about, because I've been thinking so much about addiction

Jasmin Singer: Yeah.

Mariann Sullivan: uh,

Jasmin Singer: 'cause of

Mariann Sullivan: of your play,

Jasmin Singer: right.

Mariann Sullivan: Um, where you played Judy Garland and it's ongoing now, so I've seen it a couple of times

Jasmin Singer: You, you're seeing it one more time. You're such a good, you're such a good person seeing it one more time.

Mariann Sullivan: And, uh, and, you know, addiction. Uh, I've had a lot of addiction in my family. I mean, alcoholism, like, and, you know, whatever. And I just have always thought that addiction stops growth.

Like as soon as you become addicted, you stop growing as a person. And I think a lot of people feel that way. And when they stop, a lot of people, when they stop, they, they talk about how they have to kind of catch up emotionally. And you know, just as you get older, you, you learn to, I mean, just to imagine living through your twenties again.

Oh my god.

Jasmin Singer: Thank you.

Mariann Sullivan: it would be lovely to live through your twenties again. If, if, if you didn't have to go through all the, that pain. But there's so much pain and, and you know, addiction just, it solves the pain temporarily and so you don't grow. And, and uh, you know, I was just thinking in, in context of Rob Reiner, like this absolutely horrifying story and I don't know anything about the actual situation, but I do know that, um, their son who, who's accused of the murder, has been addicted from a very young child. And you know, I, I would imagine there are also some serious mental I illness issues. You know, they all go together

Jasmin Singer: Yeah.

Mariann Sullivan: but, um, I don't know how I got started on that, but it, it's really been on my mind and I wanted to talk about it. And that story just really ha what a tragic tragedy. Too many tragedies going on. It's been a really tough week. I'm sure everybody's feeling it.

Jasmin Singer: Yeah.

Mariann Sullivan: you know, especially at this moment with the holidays, when you kind of feel you're supposed to feel cheerful

Jasmin Singer: Mm-hmm.

Mariann Sullivan: and, you know, the, the whole Sydney story is just beyond belief and the, the more you read about it, the more stories coming out of it, of heroism and, and, and just utter sadness.

And, and then there was the shooting at Brown where they still haven't caught the guy.

Jasmin Singer: Well, at the time of this recording. Yeah. And, um, yeah, the,

Mariann Sullivan: This will go up tomorrow,

Jasmin Singer: we know,

Mariann Sullivan: Wednesday.

Jasmin Singer: We know a lot of, I mean Moore, Moore is a Brown alumni and I was recently at

Mariann Sullivan: I know a lot of people who went to Brown.

Jasmin Singer: Yeah. And a lot of people in our community, in the animal rights community in Rochester have ties to Brown for some reason. And I was at the campus last year. I, I, I mean, it, it's just, obviously it's not a unique event and that's what part of what makes it so awful.

It's really inexplicable. I mean, I like when I was coming of age when I was young and, and in high school there, there was, I think we, someone went to a payphone, which is what we had then, and like called in bomb threats to my school and we like missed school for a week and we all were like, yay.

Mariann Sullivan: all, I imagine we all had a few of those.

Jasmin Singer: Yeah. And we

Mariann Sullivan: at my age that used to happen

Jasmin Singer: right.

And we were so excited. And now like my niece is a sophomore in high school and it.

Mariann Sullivan: it's no joke.

Jasmin Singer: no joke. Like they, they prepare for it and, and, uh, yeah, she, it, it's,

Mariann Sullivan: was very young, we used to prepare for atomic war

Jasmin Singer: you know, it's crazy.

Mariann Sullivan: our little pathetic desks in order to prepare for

Jasmin Singer: Oh my God. Did that freak you out?

Mariann Sullivan: have been. I don't remember. I mean, I can't imagine. I, I, I don't think so. I mean, I think at the point there where this was happening, it was probably in the fifties and I was pretty young, and you, you know, when you're a kid you just do what they do. But some point I looked back on it and freaked me out, like it was so stupid.

Jasmin Singer: Well, okay.

Mariann Sullivan: was part of the, I mean, I'm not blaming anybody. It was part, they were freaked out too. Like the atomic bomb had not been that long before we were, you know, there was a, the, uh, the whole Cold War was just really, really serious and people were very frightened and so they tried to think of what they could do. Uh, that was not a very good idea. Like I don't think we would've survived. I mean, 'cause the main fear is the, the radiation not like,

Jasmin Singer: Sure.

Mariann Sullivan: not like your desk getting hit.

Jasmin Singer: Yeah. But you know, there's the, uh.

Mariann Sullivan: This conversation has gotten too dark and I wanted it to be... To, I wanted us to touch on all of the darkness, but also try to put it into the context of Christmas and Hanukkah, which are

Jasmin Singer: Well,

Mariann Sullivan: happy holidays.

Jasmin Singer: I just say one more thing before we go into the happy and then I promise we'll we'll pivot to happy.

Mariann Sullivan: go into the happy, I just wanted to, to, to,

Jasmin Singer: No, I think we should go into the happy, I wanna, but I just wanna say, I got a text from a, a very, very close friend of mine who's vegan. I'm, see, I'm making it animal rightsy. And, uh, they, they texted me and said, you know, I only check the headlines every few days.

I mean, good for them. How does that work?

Mariann Sullivan: I

Jasmin Singer: they said, so I just wanted to check in with, within you, I check, I wanted to check in with you in light of all the news that I'm suddenly hearing. Because when they like came to, they saw all of the above, and I wrote back to them and we had a little back and forth.

So the next day they said, they sent me another text and said, I'm fine, everything's fine. But I've spent the day at the ER because I've had severe chest pains all day, and they found absolutely nothing wrong. And I'm thinking like these texts are not, you know, mutually exclusive. Like they're not happening in a vacuum.

I mean, I, I'm bringing this up because whether we're taking it in on a visceral level or not, this world is affecting each of us and some of us much more. So. I have a friend who lost her government benefits recently. Uh, the, and even for people who are, you know, in more privileged positions, the, the headlines are seeping in.

And so it, I think it is important to really, really focus on the happy when we can. Like, you know, I'm in this play as, which has been like the time of my life and there are pieces of what's going on with the play that have been just driving me nuts and, and, and then I'm like, you know what? Whatever. Like, I, I can't think about that right now because I'm having the time of my life and I wanna focus on that.

But when we're in the holidays, Christmas, Hanukkah, Kwanza, whatever you celebrate or don't celebrate. Solstice, you know, these times of change. It is so important to take a moment and just focus on the good and, and, and it doesn't mean that the bad's not happening, but it means it give you, give, you get like a one minute reprieve from thinking about it, whatever that means to you.

Mariann Sullivan: I, I, I totally agree. And I also wanted to say, and this isn't for everybody, I'm just gonna add one thing and then we can talk a little bit about what's been going on, but. I, I, I mean, I'm, this isn't me preaching, I, I, I think people handle, religion in a lot of different ways. And, and some people just really reject the holidays because, you know, they lost their meaning for them and because of, uh, they've lost their, you know, maybe they were believers when they were a child and they no longer are, or whatever. And I just think it's possible. I mean, what I do, I have happy memories of Christmas mostly. There were a few bad ones. Um. But I think it's a, like a celebration is a great thing and I just don't have to think of it as true. And I, I think that you can celebrate Christmas without thinking. it, the story was all true.

You can just think of it as a lovely story or, I mean, I like to use the word myth. I don't think you like the word myth, but like something like, like why not accept? I mean, not all of Christian Christianity is beautiful, but so what? So you don't have to like the ones that, the parts that you don't like. Like it's all up to you.

Like

Jasmin Singer: And

Mariann Sullivan: can be what you want it to be.

What they want it to be. And if you think it's a nice story that doesn't happen to be true for, you know, in your, in your, in your world, like you can still, like do it however you want. I hate the rules around. Uh, well, you know, you have to believe, you have to

Jasmin Singer: Sure.

Mariann Sullivan: we say in order to have this holiday or else you're just, you're, you know, if you wanna believe in the Santa Claus part, that's great.

If you wanna believe in the Jesus part, well, you don't have to believe it. You just have to sell. You

Jasmin Singer: You have to opt in for a minute. Yeah, and I, and

Mariann Sullivan: so inarticulate right

Jasmin Singer: no, let me just say it's, and also.

Mariann Sullivan: to say

Jasmin Singer: It's the same with the Maccabees. It's the same with any any story. And the only reason I don't like the word myth is because of, you know, semantics and personal opinion. But I like the idea of storytelling. I like the idea of ritual.

I like the idea of like, uh, passing down stories as long, as, long as in my opinion, you're honest with younger generations that their stories. Um, therein lies madness when it comes to religion, IMO. But, uh, yeah, I mean, sure, absolutely. We are allowed to enjoy things like the, you know,

Mariann Sullivan: Certainly, probably was a historical Jesus. I don't think they're sure absolutely sure of that, but I think there probably was. But so what I mean just 'cause there was a real, there was a real element of the story doesn't mean you can't make of it what you

Jasmin Singer: and.

Mariann Sullivan: And definitely, definitely.

I like the approach of, of believing, uh, that the historical Jesus, whoever he was or whatever he was doing, was undoubtedly vegan. Whether he was God or not. 'Cause you know, he was smart.

Jasmin Singer: I love that.

Mariann Sullivan: He said my very favorite thing, or did my very favorite thing at the Sermon on the Mount, and that was like he took the, the dead fish and the one loaf of bread and fed the multitude.

So therefore, um, he invented, uh, cultured meat.

Jasmin Singer: Totes. Totes.

Mariann Sullivan: Makes sense.

Jasmin Singer: Thanks, Jesus.

Mariann Sullivan: Thanks, Jesus.

Jasmin Singer: We, we hope you're listening. Uh, sorry for being an Athiest Jew, but you know, you Judaism too, so thanks.

Mariann Sullivan: The, the Jesus in my brain is delighted that you're an atheist Jew.

Jasmin Singer: So yeah, a hundred percent. I love that. Uh, but, you know, happy Mary, whatever, you know, like I, I was watching this Judy Garland.

Mariann Sullivan: And I know the world is horrible right now, and you can't totally forget that, but you can have two things at the same time.

Jasmin Singer: I was watching this Judy Garland, uh, video

Mariann Sullivan: Oh, really?

Jasmin Singer: Yeah, I know. Shocking. And at the beginning of it,

Mariann Sullivan: there to know that Jasmin has not talked about anything except Judy Garland for, for at least two months.

Jasmin Singer: Two months? It's whole lot longer than that. Uh, but I was watching one, and at the very beginning, this was from a movie. But it was sort of like, kind of loosely, the part seemed to be loosely based on her. And at the very beginning she had like a fur coat and, and she said this awful, horrible thing about like, you know, the fur coat and like, and it was one second of the video and then she went into this glorious singing and like, am I giving her a pass on that?

No. She was a very, very flawed and complicated person. And I, and I could say, well.

Mariann Sullivan: Everybody wore fur

Jasmin Singer: For sure.

Mariann Sullivan: was out

Jasmin Singer: Exactly. Exactly. But I am, I, I am not going to turn the video off at that point because I want to get to enjoy this video and this singing, and so it, it, it just reminds me of the same thing. Like as vegans, we can, we can turn things off because something horrible and oppressive happens, or we can choose to put it, like compartmentalize it for the sake of like enjoying life.

And I'm not saying second guess your ethics or do things you're not comfortable with. There are things that I refuse to, like, there are things that cross the line for me. I don't like to watch things where, you know, there's any kind of, uh, you know, horse racing in it or something like that, because I know what's going on in that moment.

Mariann Sullivan: I mean, and that's also like, like it's not that, that watching that has any effect on the world, but who wants to watch that? I mean, wasn't there a certain point where you started watching movies, or whatever, that had real animals in them, and you started realizing, like, looking at the animal, like, not in the context of the story but as, I wonder what he was actually thinking at that moment.

Like. Then you can't watch it anymore, but not because it's, you know, you're doing something immoral, just because ruins it.

Jasmin Singer: Yeah, a hundred percent. I mean, to be, and I know that you're probably gonna roll your eyes a little bit at this, but like there was a point earlier on in my like LGBTQ journey or whatever that I was like, Ugh, why are all these songs on the radio so heteronormative? And then one day I was like, you know what?

Fuck it. I'm gonna let this song be relevant to me too.

Mariann Sullivan: mean that, that I, I am rolling my

Jasmin Singer: I know you are, but

Mariann Sullivan: heterosexuals in the world.

Jasmin Singer: No, I'm not. Hold on. I'm not saying that that's the case. I'm just saying like at the, there was a point where I was like, okay, this isn't for me 'cause it's about a, he, you know, a man and a woman or whatever. And at some point I'm like, I'm just, you know, I'm just gonna get the essence of this and I'm allowed to enjoy it.

I'm allowed to enjoy... i, I don't have to suffer.

Mariann Sullivan: that's totally different 'cause they're not doing anything wrong.

Jasmin Singer: Right. I I, of course I agree with that though. You know, it would be nicer there to be a few more lesbian songs in the world. But, um, alright, so

Mariann Sullivan: You're the one who's supposed to sing them. All right. Are we gonna go through these articles or, or like let's

Jasmin Singer: yeah, what do you wanna talk, what do you wanna talk about?

Mariann Sullivan: Alright. There is just one piece of pretty bad news and I'm gonna get it out of the way. And that's at this trial, you know, we've been talking a lot about the Animal Rising, um, trials in the UK. The ones at the horse races, they've all gotten acquittal as well. There was just the one at, um, at, um, beagle breeder, just like the beagle breeders here. uh. They got, they, they got convicted. Um, they rescued 18 Beagle puppies. The place is called NBR Acres. I think it's huge.

Absolutely huge. And, uh, we, you know, they haven't been sentenced yet. It's really scary. They're facing up to 10 years, I think. And also they point out, actually this is probably just for people in the UK so, uh, just go to the Animal Rising site. If you're not familiar with that. The, the government is, is kind of using this opportunity to push a change in the law, which would effectively criminalize even peaceful protest against animal testing. So that is just disgraceful and uh, so that's the bad news. Alright, out of the way.

Jasmin Singer: Hmm

Mariann Sullivan: Pretty bad news.

Jasmin Singer: mm-hmm.

Mariann Sullivan: I wanted to, um, mention the fact that, um, Torre Washington is going to Mister Olympia 2026, which

Jasmin Singer: Oh.

Mariann Sullivan: in the bodybuilding world is a very big deal.

Jasmin Singer: Oh, that's so cool. Was he on right? He was on Our Hen House. Right? You interviewed him.

Mariann Sullivan: The, um, episode 663. 663. He was charming! I remember he was a nightmare to schedule with, and he was late for the interview and I totally hated him. And then he got on for two seconds. He was completely charming!

Jasmin Singer: You know, he is just busy. Like I, that's happened to me with other people too, especially celebrities and like he is,

Mariann Sullivan: Yeah. I mean it,

Jasmin Singer: but.

Mariann Sullivan: yeah, it,

Jasmin Singer: And then they're wonderful and it... that's so cool.

Mariann Sullivan: I can, yeah, no. So he is in his fifties and

Jasmin Singer: Wow.

Mariann Sullivan: 'cause he also has a consulting business, um, which he talked about in the interview, uh, where he helps people. You know, obvi, he's, he's totally, um, plant-based and, and totally natural, like no drugs, which I guess is a big deal in the body building world. And, um, his, his consulting business or, you know, teaching business of people is, is, uh, for people over 40. So he is really focusing on that particular population, which I love. Um, alright,

Jasmin Singer: I love that.

Mariann Sullivan: That was from Plant-based News. I

Jasmin Singer: Good for him. Good for him.

Mariann Sullivan: where credit is due. um, another thing I wanted to talk about, I don't know whether we should talk about this, but I was just, uh, uh. I mean, it's just a tour of Mexico City, but I wanna go to Mexico so much, and I wanna go to Mexico mostly to eat the food. I, you know, I, you, you hear about good Mexican food. I mean, and, and I like Mexican American food. I mean, I don't think it's bad food. I love it. But because I'm vegan, I've never really been to a high-end, um, Mexican restaurant because I don't know. There, you know, there is, there, is the one in, um, or it's a chain in, in New York City. Jajaja. Um, which is good. So I guess I'm kind of lying, but

Jasmin Singer: Some people call it Ja ja Ja. But I think you're right that it's hahaha. Yeah.

Mariann Sullivan: ha ha ha. I mean, come on, it's Spanish.

Jasmin Singer: I know, I'm just saying.

Mariann Sullivan: I don't even speak Spanish, but that seems obvious. Anyway, they're just talking about this, um, this tour, the Cheap Lazy Vegan, uh, ro the woman's name is Rosalie, um, did, and it just sounded unbelievable. There's a restaurant called Roma Norte with pink tacos and Oajacan mole. There's a lot of, this is about mole, which I think is annoying because I can't eat chocolate. But, um, LA Pita Hay Vegana. Um. known for tortillas, uh, and, um, tofu curry and cauliflower tacos, chilaquiles topped with chickpea chorrizo and greens.

It just sounded so good, so I just thought I'd mentioned it.

Jasmin Singer: Yeah,

Mariann Sullivan: it. Um,

Jasmin Singer: you know.

Mariann Sullivan: then another I really wanted to mention, I'm not gonna talk about this a lot, but it also hearkens back to another interview that we did. We did it with Rosie Wardle, who was then, um, heading up, uh, this, um, this company for investors, Fairr, F-A-I-R-R.

It's not a company. It's an initiative where investors all get together and they encourage investors to join and it's to promote, plant-based products and divest from animal products. They're doing amazing work. I don't think Rosie is any longer with them. Um, but there's, uh, there, there's an article about it on Plant-based News and we're talking about trillions of dollars in assets.

Um, the, the investors who are part of the Fairr Initiative. Uh, so it's, it. think it's just such a brilliant idea bringing all of these, um, investors together and encouraging the move to protein diversification. Uh, so I thought I'd mention that too also on Plant-based News where we get all of our good news.

Jasmin Singer: Plant-based news is just doing great work. Or just again, you giving credit. It where credit is due. If you're not following them,

Mariann Sullivan: No, they're, they're also, they're fun. Like I

Jasmin Singer: they're fun, but like they're, they're, they're also,

Mariann Sullivan: and the news and uh,

Jasmin Singer: And there's like a grit. There's a grit there. Like it's not, it's, yeah. I love it. Go ahead.

Mariann Sullivan: All right. Another thing I wanted to mention, this is an article from Humane World for Animals. And everybody knows this, but it was a good article and it's, this is not the good news part.

Um, animal shelters are in crisis. It hasn't gotten better, folks. Um, you know, there was a lot of talk after the pandemic that it was because of people going back to work, but it's much more complex than that, as this, um, article points out and animal shelters are in big trouble. They're not big enough, they're not able to handle the animals fostering is so important.

Um, and, uh, they, they, they focus specifically on a shelter in Baton Rouge and a shelter in New York City, but they're really talking about all of them. There's, um, they're seeing a rise in the numbers coming in, but also the animals are not getting adopted quickly. Big dogs are unbelievably at risk and some of the reasons they talk about, I mean, it has a lot to do with the economy. Both the fact that, um, that veterinarians, there's a nationwide shortage of veterinarians. So spay and neuter services are not being, uh, and they were, they were not suspended during the pandemic. So that built up a huge number of puppies who otherwise wouldn't have been born. And, and now, like people can't afford veterinary bills.

And we all know that's true. We're all experiencing it.

Jasmin Singer: Yeah.

Mariann Sullivan: That the veterinary costs have gone up. Unbelievable. Since 2019, the cost of pet services such as veterinary bills and grooming has climbed 42%. 42%, while the cost of pet food has risen 22%. So, you know, and then, and then we have things like the people, uh, who are on, you know, lower incomes are being hurt on the, you know, in other ways too, like, like, uh, the SNAP program being, um, defeated. The thing going on with, uh, um, medical, uh, insurance, that people's rents are gonna go so high. Every time people's income shrinks, pets end up in the, um, in... and the housing crisis!

More and more people are renting because they can't afford to buy.

Jasmin Singer: Mm-hmm.

Mariann Sullivan: A lot to do with the large dogs. You can't bring a large dog to a lot of, um... anyway, you know, all of this, I'm just going on and

Jasmin Singer: No.

Mariann Sullivan: You know, everybody who can foster should, and everybody who can't, should donate a little money to their local shelter.

Jasmin Singer: And, and, and speaking of,

Mariann Sullivan: in your community, give 'em some love.

Jasmin Singer: Well, and speaking of people who are doing a good job in the community, I have two shout outs before we conclude today. One is for Tamerlaine Sanctuary and Preserve. And this is, uh, one of our incredible listeners, Sarah Murray, uh, wanted us to mention Tamerlaine, and you could find out more at tamerlaine.org.

It's T-A-M-E-R-L-A-I-N e.org. Uh, so Tamerlaine does great work. You should also follow them on, uh, social media. They, they are, you know, like all sanctuaries doing their end of year fundraising. Um, and, and, and they do beautiful work. So thank you Sarah, for supporting so many great causes, including Our Hen House and for, uh, the idea to mention Tamerlaine.

And also Dr. Joanne Kong has a new book out. She's been on Our Hen House years ago. She's an incredible, you know, thinker and writer and, and she has a new book out that I wanted to highlight for anyone who has people in their community who maybe wanted go vegan in the new year.

'Cause as we know, that's a important time to go vegan. She has a new book called Vegan Made Easy, A Practical Guide to Plant-Based Living. And this is a great gift for any new vegan or even vegan curious folks. It's published by Lantern. We're going to put the link on this, uh, book to, on, on our show notes, of course.

And you could also just Google Vegan Made Easy Dr. Joanne Kong, and you'll see it. But it, you know, there are some, some of these books that exist, including my own, shameless plug, The Veg News Guide to Being a Fabulous Vegan. But what I love is that they're all different and the, the more recent they are, the more recent the information is.

And, uh, the fact that this is, you know, co-authored by Dr. Joanne Kong offers and it looks like a really fun and very accessible book. Uh, it's, it's about the how and why to go vegan and, uh, it includes everything about like social justice and health and sustainability and just like how to transition. And, uh, so I'm, I'm excited that there's another book out there and of course, Lantern publishes and has for so long some really important books.

So definitely check those out.

Mariann Sullivan: It's a great gift idea. You can be that vegan, the one who gives all

Jasmin Singer: yeah, and you can make fun of it too.

Mariann Sullivan: how to go vegan books because just be that vegan, like screw 'em.

Jasmin Singer: And also you can sort of make fun of yourself about that before they get a chance to, like I I'm being that vegan.

Mariann Sullivan: People who would never admit that they would consider it, but you know, if you give them a book that they can look at in the privacy of their own home.

Jasmin Singer: Yeah. And let me also. Yeah. Let me also say this is, uh, taking a page, so to speak, from Dr. Neil Barnard. Uh, what he does when he gifts books is he puts like little post-its it on random pages and says, this made me think of you. I mean, he might be more specific than that. Like he might, he might actually give more thought, but I believe it's pretty random.

And it, it engages the person you're giving it to.

Mariann Sullivan: Good idea.

Jasmin Singer: Yeah. Yeah.

Mariann Sullivan: Just be careful if you're doing it randomly.

Jasmin Singer: Right. It'll be like constipation. Constipation. Page 86. This made me think of you. Uh, so anyway, congrats to, uh, Joanne on that project as well. And, and congrats to us because we have had such a successful year. We're not quite done with Our Hen House for the year.

We still have a couple more weeks, but we're going, we're gearing quickly up to our 16 year anniversary, and we've, we've published, uh, this is our 883rd episode of Our Hen House. We also have more, well more than a hundred episodes of, of the Animal Law Podcast. And, uh, our end of year fundraiser is crucial to these efforts.

And this year due to the generosity of our largest donors, all donations are being tripled. So between now and the end of the year for every dollar you donate, we'll receive two more. And I do wanna say, because of some foundational support that is drying up, this might be the last year of the triple match.

We're hopefully gonna have a double match in the future. Uh, again, thanks to our generous, highest donors, but if you want to really make a huge impact, go to ourhenhouse.org/support and donate to Our Hen House because we need you and you need us. And so we're in a codependent relationship. We might as well nurse that.

Thank you so much. Happy holigays and we'll talk to you next time.